Trike vs. 3 axis fixed wing

[Dunewood Truglia, Esq.]

What is the advantage of a trike over a regular 3 axis fixed wing UL. Which
is more stable in flight. I have a private but haven't flown for a decade
and want to try something new ( after instruction and biannual of course ).

Thanks,

Dunewood

[Robert Walden]

For me the advantage of a trike is the wide open fun factor like riding
a motorcycle, wind in the face seat of the pants flying, simple
preflight (less parts), the ability to change, buy, or sell, trade wings
to change flight characteristics and speeds, easy to dissasemble wing
and haul the trike on a simple trailer, the ability to use 40 to 65 hp
engines, low and slow flight over open fields is great fun. Keep in mind
some 3-axis ultralights like the simple quicksilver have some of these
traits also. Robert Walden




http://community.webtv.net/rwflyer/LibertyTrike

http://community.webtv.net/rlwalden/LibertyHKS

http://community.webtv.net/trikepics/LibertyHksSpirit

http://community.webtv.net/rwflyer/Liberty503

[John Rockrohr]

I was looking at trikes for the last 2 years for the low-slow flying
characteristics, and STOL capabilities, and I liked the open feeling even
though I do fly in the winter time ( I currently fly a 3-axis Rotec Rally).
After a lot of researching articles, and asking specific questions of pilots
and manufacturers at Oshkosh, I found the following:

1. Trikes don't have as good STOL characteristics as a lot of 3-axis
ultralights. A lot depends on the wing, but by getting good STOL you
sacrifice speed which isn't that fast anyway.

2. Trikes have more difficulty landing & taking off in cross winds than a
3-axis ultralight.

3. Trikes are easier to trailer, and take up less space to hangar.

4. Trikes have a lot more options as far as wings, & engines on the same
frame.

I've seen a lot of trikes in magazine articles flying cross country, and
over mountains which you think they would encounter having to land and take
off on short strips, and a lot of cross winds, and be wishing for a heated
cockpit. I've written to both Experimenter (now Sport Pilot), and
Ultralight magazine to do some type of comparison, of capabilities of both
Trikes & 3-axis ultralights, but that was over a year ago, and if they did,
I missed it. I also spoke to a few Trike dealers, but it seemed they didn't
have any, or much experience with any 3-axis flying.

I'm currently rebuilding a wrecked Challenger I finally bought, to get
into something with a little more capabilities and ability to handle
thermals better than my little Rotec Rally, but I'm still very intrigued by
trikes, just can't get any information that there is an advantage over
3-axis other than trailerability which I currently don't need.
---------------------------------
Honestly I have not flown a trike, this is just information I've gathered
from people who have, or the manufacturers at Oshkosh, and magazine
articles, good luck, I'm keeping an eye on any other responses.
--------------------------------
John Rockrohr

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
What is the advantage of a trike over a regular 3 axis fixed wing UL. Which
is more stable in flight. I have a private but haven't flown for a decade
and want to try something new ( after instruction and biannual of course ).
Thanks,
Dunewood

[D. Grunloh]

Post by John Rockrohr
I was looking at trikes for the last 2 years for the low-slow flying
characteristics, and STOL capabilities, and I liked the open feeling even
though I do fly in the winter time ( I currently fly a 3-axis Rotec Rally).
After a lot of researching articles, and asking specific questions of pilots
1. Trikes don't have as good STOL characteristics as a lot of 3-axis
ultralights. A lot depends on the wing, but by getting good STOL you
sacrifice speed which isn't that fast anyway.

I don't belive I would agree with that generalization.

Many trikes have very good STOL capabilies and some
exceed anything you could even imagine on a 3-axis.
Compare themn empty weight for empty weight and
with the same engine.

A single seat trike with 447 like my Air Creation Racer
takes off in 125 feet and clinbs at 1100 FPM with a
Rotax 447. Quite a few single seat 3-axis ultralights don't
fly very well with only a 447.

In 2-seat trikes a Rotax 503 will easily fly two very big pilots
and give STOL performance with slow wings not attainable on
any 3-axis ultralight I can imagine.

Trike wings can achive a high angle of attack during the takeoff
roll making them superior to most tri-geared planes on soft
field STOL takeoffs.

On landing the trike wing can be pulled to a negative angle of
attack and achive considerable aerdynamic braking. Most trikes
also have a robusr nosewheel drum brake.

---Dan Grunloh

Post by John Rockrohr
2. Trikes have more difficulty landing & taking off in cross winds than a
3-axis ultralight.
3. Trikes are easier to trailer, and take up less space to hangar.
4. Trikes have a lot more options as far as wings, & engines on the same
frame.
I've seen a lot of trikes in magazine articles flying cross country, and
over mountains which you think they would encounter having to land and take
off on short strips, and a lot of cross winds, and be wishing for a heated
cockpit. I've written to both Experimenter (now Sport Pilot), and
Ultralight magazine to do some type of comparison, of capabilities of both
Trikes & 3-axis ultralights, but that was over a year ago, and if they did,
I missed it. I also spoke to a few Trike dealers, but it seemed they didn't
have any, or much experience with any 3-axis flying.
I'm currently rebuilding a wrecked Challenger I finally bought, to get
into something with a little more capabilities and ability to handle
thermals better than my little Rotec Rally, but I'm still very intrigued by
trikes, just can't get any information that there is an advantage over
3-axis other than trailerability which I currently don't need.
---------------------------------
Honestly I have not flown a trike, this is just information I've gathered
from people who have, or the manufacturers at Oshkosh, and magazine
articles, good luck, I'm keeping an eye on any other responses.
--------------------------------
John Rockrohr

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
What is the advantage of a trike over a regular 3 axis fixed wing UL.

Which

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
is more stable in flight. I have a private but haven't flown for a decade
and want to try something new ( after instruction and biannual of

course ).

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
Thanks,
Dunewood

[Mike Marron]

Anyone have any experience in trikes mounted on inflatable dingies or
floats? The WetTrike and Polaris look interesting, but there seems to be no
one on the Chesapeake Bay who is flying a "wet" trike. If there is, I'd love
to know about it....

I've got a few hundred hours flying both trikes and 3-axis UL's
(MU582 Drifters) off water. In my view, 3-axis is far better in the
liquid arena, but nothing pegs the "fun meter" like my land-based,
N-numbered, Pegasus Quantum 912 trike.

[Fr. John Elledge]

Mike:

That's about what I figured. After having been out on the water in a 3-axis
and having it weathervane into the wind, trying to "sail" it backwards on
the water because the wing tip was dipping perilously close to the water. I
figured that the kite would really be a handful in similar circumstances.

Why did I get myself into such a mess? First time, I was taking float flying
lessons with a friend when the weather quickly changed. The wind further
down on the bay didn't seem to be too bad, but when we got up to the
Susquehanna, it was rocking and rolling. That's when I found out about
"sailing" a plane on the water.

The second time was the day before Hurrican Isabel was due to hit. I had the
plane in the water at a marina. I knew that I had to get it to somewhere
more secure, namely on one of the floating docks at the seaplane base. I
drove my plane out of the safety of the marina out into the Susquehanna and
tried to turn right to go downstream. The wind was whistling down the river.
I weathervaned, pointing the nose upstream. I had one heck of a time
alternately gunning the engine to get some steering and get closer to the
river bank, then trying to sail backwards into the marina. I finally figured
out that when I dropped the flaps I had better backwards steerability in
sailing. I got it back into the marina, paddled around until I got it
pointed right, gunned it to 3/4 throttle, roared out into the river
downsteam, and water taxied lickity split to the seaplane base.

Sorry. I got carried away, just remembering it. Forgive me.

Blessings, Mike,
Fr. John

Post by Mike Marron

Anyone have any experience in trikes mounted on inflatable dingies or
floats? The WetTrike and Polaris look interesting, but there seems to be no
one on the Chesapeake Bay who is flying a "wet" trike. If there is, I'd love
to know about it....

I've got a few hundred hours flying both trikes and 3-axis UL's
(MU582 Drifters) off water. In my view, 3-axis is far better in the
liquid arena, but nothing pegs the "fun meter" like my land-based,
N-numbered, Pegasus Quantum 912 trike.

[Fr. John Elledge]

Anyone have any experience in trikes mounted on inflatable dingies or
floats? The WetTrike and Polaris look interesting, but there seems to be no
one on the Chesapeake Bay who is flying a "wet" trike. If there is, I'd love
to know about it....

Blessings!
Fr. John

Post by D. Grunloh

Post by John Rockrohr
I was looking at trikes for the last 2 years for the low-slow flying
characteristics, and STOL capabilities, and I liked the open feeling even
though I do fly in the winter time ( I currently fly a 3-axis Rotec Rally).
After a lot of researching articles, and asking specific questions of pilots
1. Trikes don't have as good STOL characteristics as a lot of 3-axis
ultralights. A lot depends on the wing, but by getting good STOL you
sacrifice speed which isn't that fast anyway.

I don't belive I would agree with that generalization.
Many trikes have very good STOL capabilies and some
exceed anything you could even imagine on a 3-axis.
Compare themn empty weight for empty weight and
with the same engine.
A single seat trike with 447 like my Air Creation Racer
takes off in 125 feet and clinbs at 1100 FPM with a
Rotax 447. Quite a few single seat 3-axis ultralights don't
fly very well with only a 447.
In 2-seat trikes a Rotax 503 will easily fly two very big pilots
and give STOL performance with slow wings not attainable on
any 3-axis ultralight I can imagine.
Trike wings can achive a high angle of attack during the takeoff
roll making them superior to most tri-geared planes on soft
field STOL takeoffs.
On landing the trike wing can be pulled to a negative angle of
attack and achive considerable aerdynamic braking. Most trikes
also have a robusr nosewheel drum brake.
---Dan Grunloh

Post by John Rockrohr
2. Trikes have more difficulty landing & taking off in cross winds than a
3-axis ultralight.
3. Trikes are easier to trailer, and take up less space to hangar.
4. Trikes have a lot more options as far as wings, & engines on the same
frame.
I've seen a lot of trikes in magazine articles flying cross country, and
over mountains which you think they would encounter having to land and take
off on short strips, and a lot of cross winds, and be wishing for a heated
cockpit. I've written to both Experimenter (now Sport Pilot), and
Ultralight magazine to do some type of comparison, of capabilities of both
Trikes & 3-axis ultralights, but that was over a year ago, and if they did,
I missed it. I also spoke to a few Trike dealers, but it seemed they didn't
have any, or much experience with any 3-axis flying.
I'm currently rebuilding a wrecked Challenger I finally bought, to get
into something with a little more capabilities and ability to handle
thermals better than my little Rotec Rally, but I'm still very intrigued by
trikes, just can't get any information that there is an advantage over
3-axis other than trailerability which I currently don't need.
---------------------------------
Honestly I have not flown a trike, this is just information I've gathered
from people who have, or the manufacturers at Oshkosh, and magazine
articles, good luck, I'm keeping an eye on any other responses.
--------------------------------
John Rockrohr

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
What is the advantage of a trike over a regular 3 axis fixed wing UL.

Which

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
is more stable in flight. I have a private but haven't flown for a decade
and want to try something new ( after instruction and biannual of

course ).

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
Thanks,
Dunewood

[Martin Frank McKinstry]

I fly both trikes and 3-axis. For the last 4 years I have spent all my hours in
the trikes. I like the motorcycle feel. Just more of a sport feel than 3-axis to
me. I think it is a lot like a waverunner compared to a boat. Small sport type
craft but in a 3 dimensional space. I also flew hanggliders for 4 years so I
like the feel of this type of wing.

If anyone is interested I have a left over dealer demo Cosmos trike with approx.
40 hours on it. Only used for intro flights. No student landings!
It is a Cosmos Bison 2 seater with a 503 Rotax dual carbs. 900 pound BRS, IVO 3
blade prop. EGT, CHT TACH. Blue, yellow and red 16 meter dual surface wing.
Setup for dual controls with feet, wing bars and 2 throttles. Replacement cost
well over 20K not including the chute! Closed my delaership and will accept
$16500 if you pick up in Chicago western suburbs.

Marty

Post by Dunewood Truglia, Esq.
What is the advantage of a trike over a regular 3 axis fixed wing UL. Which
is more stable in flight. I have a private but haven't flown for a decade
and want to try something new ( after instruction and biannual of course ).
Thanks,
Dunewood